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A cautionary tale of the past, present, and (possible) future. (And a tip of the hat to Mr. Artie Blair...)
1984: It was nearly eleven hundred, and in the Records Department, where Winston worked, they were dragging the chairs out of the cubicles and grouping them in the centre of the hall opposite the big telescreen, in preparation for the Two Minutes Hate.
"I'm getting ready to buy a company that makes 250 to 280 thousand dollars a year," Wurzelbacher said. "Your new tax plan is going to tax me more, isn't it?"1984: The next moment a hideous, grinding speech, as of some monstrous machine running without oil, burst from the big telescreen at the end of the room. It was a noise that set one's teeth on edge and bristled the hair at the back of one's neck.
And for the record, Obama gave a long, thoughtful answer that indicated he understood that Joe was talking about business revenue - not personal income ("if your revenue is above 250 – then from 250 down, your taxes are going to stay the same") - but that boils down to "yes". And this is the bottom line - at least, it's the reason Obama gave Joe for raising taxes on his business: "I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."
And for the record, here's what I said about that yesterday: "...Obama [has reached] a point in the polls where he can tell a plumber to his face that he's going to raise his taxes to give the money to others without fear of alienating the Great Independent American Center."
All three presidential debates are now history. With just 20 days left until the election, judging from the polls and Sen. John McCain's overall sub par performance Wednesday night in which he needed a knockout but failed to get one, it looks as though Sen. Barack Obama is well on his way to becoming the 44th President of the United States. That is of course barring any acts of terrorism, widespread election fraud and/or large-scale racism.1984: The Hate had started.
As a post-mortem to the debate, I have some questions for McCain:
1. Who the fuck is Joe the Plumber, and why is he so important to have been mentioned 21 times by you? And, why is he the only American you referred to the entire evening?
2. Is Joe the Plumber a $40,000 per year working stiff or the wealthy owner of the plumbing company? In your repeated populist references to him, you implied that he's just your average blue-collar worker, yet all of your tax and health policy examples clearly had him as the more affluent entrepreneur in control of his workers' fates.
3. Who the hell cares about William Ayers and Acorn? Did you not see the new NY Times/CBS News poll indicating that voters are utterly fed up with your dirty politics and smear attacks on Obama?Dave01
Something else I just heard about "Joe the Plumber", granted it came from Obama supporter, Robert Gibbs, but "Joe the Plumber" was already going for McShrub BEFORE Obama knocked on his door over the weekend.
So Joe the plumber was already a McCain supporter. Like I said, this came from an Obama supporter, but if that is true, he wasn't going to be swayed no matter what. The voters that both candidates are going for at this point are NOT their base, it is the "undecided" voters - if there really are such people at this point.
Posted 12:50 AM on 10/16/2008proreality
"Joe the plumber" is a tool and a Republican plant. He is part of a family owned septic business. Him and his wife maxed out in donations to phil grams PAC. His brother is Charles Keatings son in law. When will the MSM get tired of being made a fool of?
Posted 02:14 AM on 10/16/2008xrepublican
this guy has the same (very unusual) last name as someone tied into the Keating 5 and is already owner of more than one business
and is - real shocker - NOT registered to vote.....
you can't make this stuff up.... reality - the ultimate farce
Posted 02:16 AM on 10/16/2008jsob
"Joe the Plumber" is Joe Wurzelbacher (mispronounced by McCain). He is, as you should know, someone Obama spoke with while campaigning in Ohio (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/15/joe-the-plumber-speaks-it_n_135065.html). Asking "who the f**k is Joe the Plumber" is disrespectful and uncalled for. You may question the relevance of McCain"s fixation on Joe, but you can and should do that with the same consideration Obama showed Joe when they spoke. Joe is not saying who is voting for, but he did make the effort to speak with Obama. Your poor choice of words won't help Joe and others like him decide to support Obama.
Posted 02:33 AM on 10/16/2008XME
No. Obama was knocking on doors in his neighborhood and he was out in his yard so went to talk to him. Pretty sure he's pure-bred Republican though!
Posted 02:57 AM on 10/16/2008Shashi0224
I think he's a plant.....how else would mcsame get the story? Even if this "Joe the Plumber" just happened to see Obama in his neighborhood........why would he think to get the conversation to mcsame and who did he know to get it high enough in the chain of command for it to make it to the debate at such speed? Also, the guy is obviously a mccain supporter as he was regurgitating all the right-wing talking points.
Problem here right-wing, we're not a gullible as we were 8 years ago. Americans have grown up and we smell a rat.
Posted 02:57 AM on 10/16/2008nvegrl
I just listened to the Joe's audio with Katie Couric. He said that Obama was in his neighborhood. This is something that really hit home with me. He didn't go out and seek Obama, Obama was there. I seriously doubt that McCain would be caught dead talking to the public in their neighborhoods. I've never heard of a presidential candidate door knocking. Not in recent history anyway.
Posted 07:09 AM on 10/16/2008Shashi0224
Just asking here.....how did the TRANSCRIPT of "joe the plumber" get to the mcsame campaign unless the guy is a plant for the mcssame campaign? There's something not kosher here.
I'm counting on the media getting to the bottom of this. The dirty campaign tricks of Karl Rove are stinking up the system again.
Posted 08:35 AM on 10/16/2008
As usual, the face of Emmanuel Goldstein, the Enemy of the People, had flashed on to the screen. There were hisses here and there among the audience. The little sandy-haired woman gave a squeak of mingled fear and disgust.
Mr. Wurzelbacher’s notoriety has raised the ire of Tom Joseph, business manager for Local 50 of the United Association of Plumbers, Steamfitters, and Service Mechanics, who claimed that Mr. Wurzelbacher didn’t undergo any apprenticeship training.1984: Goldstein was delivering his usual venomous attack upon the doctrines of the Party -- an attack so exaggerated and perverse that a child should have been able to see through it, and yet just plausible enough to fill one with an alarmed feeling that other people, less level-headed than oneself, might be taken in by it.
"When you have guys going out there with no training whatsoever, it’s a little disreputable to start with," Mr. Joseph said.
"This individual has got no schooling, no licenses, he’s never been to a training program, union or non-union, in the United States of America," Mr. Joseph said.
The association has endorsed Barack Obama, according to Mr. Joseph.
The premise of his complaint to Mr. Obama about taxes may also be flawed, according to tax analysts. Contrary to what Mr. Wurzelbacher asserted and Mr. McCain echoed, neither his personal taxes nor those of the business where he works are likely to rise if Mr. Obama’s tax plan were to go into effect, they said.1984: He was abusing Big Brother... he was advocating freedom of speech, freedom of the Press, freedom of assembly, freedom of thought...
Host Mike Huckabee, the former Arkansas governor and presidential candidate, began by saying that if John McCain wins, he'll largely have Mr. Wurzelbacher to thank.1984: Before the Hate had proceeded for thirty seconds, uncontrollable exclamations of rage were breaking out from half the people in the room.
"Hopefully they'll have me to thank for it as far as telling people to get out and find their own answers," Mr. Wurzelbacher said.
The media's worried about whether I paid my taxes, they're worried about any number of silly things that have nothing to do with America. They really don't. I asked a question. When you can't ask a question to your leaders anymore, that gets scary. That bothers me."
Actually, he's "Sam The Guy Who Does Plumbing," technicallly.2008:
"Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher."
His voter registration application misspells his name, btw. ("Worzelbacher.")
Patrick Levine Rose, an election attorney and appellate law specialist in East Lansing, MI asked these questions on Rick Hasen's election law listserve:Wouldn't it be ironic if Joe the Plumber lost his vote due to this mismatch in how his name appears in the voter database?
His full name is Samuel J. Wurzelbacher. And he owes back taxes, too, public records show.1984:In its second minute the Hate rose to a frenzy.
According to public records, Mr. Wurzelbacher has been subject to two liens, each over $1,100. One, with a hospital, has been settled, but a tax lien with the State of Ohio is still outstanding.
On Friday, the East Valley/Scottsdale Tribune in Arizona reported that Mr. Wurzelbacher's Arizona driver's license was suspended in May, 2000, following nonpayment of a court-imposed fine for civil traffic violations. He lived in Arizona from 1997-2000.1984: People were leaping up and down in their places and shouting at the tops of their voices in an effort to drown the maddening bleating voice that came from the screen.
During last night's presidential debate, we heard a lot about "Joe the Plumber," also known as Joe Wurzelbacher, an average (ahem) Joe, who is really worried that a President Obama might raise his taxes. But does Joe really need to worry? Because if he's the same Joe that ABC News identified as Sam Joe Wurzelbacher, also of Toledo, Ohio, he doesn't always bother to pay his taxes.1984:The little sandy-haired woman had turned bright pink, and her mouth was opening and shutting like that of a landed fish.He beats his wife, too, so he likes Palin just as much as he likes McCain (Note: not to beat Palin, but because Palin enables wife-beaters)
by DemocraticLuntz on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 10:02:34 AM PDT
1984: Even O'Brien's heavy face was flushed. He was sitting very straight in his chair, his powerful chest swelling and quivering as though he were standing up to the assault of a wave.Exactly.
Joe the Plumber is this officially week's Sarah Palin.
P.S. What are the odds this whole episode was coordinated by the McCain campaign from the beginning?
The Book of Revelation is not a foreign policy manual.
by Dont Just Stand There on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 10:37:08 AM PDTWoman's health
...what is that anyway..? (-McCain)
Congratulation McCain, you eff up big time. With this Joe wife beater cum political plumber.
But wait until the Keating 5 drama becomes fully known.
(so we have corruption, housing, scandal... all come back into same corruption, housing, scandal)
by wittg1 on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 10:33:19 AM PDT
1984: The dark-haired girl behind Winston had begun crying out 'Swine! Swine! Swine!' and suddenly she picked up a heavy Newspeak dictionary and flung it at the screen. It struck Goldstein's nose and bounced off; the voice continued inexorably.Get this crap off of here. You've got the ex-wife's address.
Let's get just a little smart folks.
You can never sink so low in life that you can't be a bad example for somebody. - My Dad.
by briefer on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 10:11:11 AM PDTNo I don't; that's 10 years old. Nobody lives there anymore.Alright; can we blur it anyway?
Who knows who lives there now?
"Think. It ain't illegal yet." - George Clinton
by jbeach on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 11:32:56 AM PDT
1984: In a lucid moment Winston found that he was shouting with the others and kicking his heel violently against the rung of his chair. The horrible thing about the Two Minutes Hate was not that one was obliged to act a part, but, on the contrary, that it was impossible to avoid joining in. Within thirty seconds any pretence was always unnecessary.Take your point about specific address info
I am sick and fucking tired of being told that, because I live in California (used to be SF), that I am somehow LESS of an American than these "average Joe" types.
Every time you scratch the surface of one of these media stereotypes in real life, they are scum.
I am a patriotic American who loves the Constitution, ideals of freedom and succeeding on merit.
And I'm sick, as an educated, gay, urban-dwelling American, of being unfavorably compared to these fake, lying, wife-beating, tax-cheating, racist, immigrant-hating frauds.
Fuck him. Fuck them. It's my America, too.
by Penman on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 10:23:51 AM PDT
No detail about the divorced father of a 13-year-old boy was too small: Was he a registered voter? Did he have a plumbing license? Whom will he vote for?1984: A hideous ecstasy of fear and vindictiveness, a desire to kill, to torture, to smash faces in with a sledge-hammer, seemed to flow through the whole group of people like an electric current, turning one even against one's will into a grimacing, screaming lunatic.
"He's trying to suggest that a plumber is the guy he's fighting for," Obama said. "How many plumbers you know that are making a quarter-million dollars a year?"
So Joe (whose name is Sam) the Plumber (who isn't a plumber) was used by McCain to attack Obama's tax proposal, though Joe/Sam actually pays less tax under Obama (if he actually got around to paying his taxes.)
Brought to you by the same people who think character attacks are more important than issues.I am John McCain and my plumber is a wife beater.
by wittg1 on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 05:12:29 PM PDTAnd I approved this idiot in 6 seconds just like I vetted my running mate.
by MrSandman on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 04:48:04 PM PDTSam the Scam Artist
One fraud shilling for another fraud. I once met a young skinhead who looked just like him except that he had swastikas tattooed on hi knuckles.
The weak in courage is strong in cunning-William Blake
by beltane on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 04:49:27 PM PDTThe 3 or 4% undecided are the ones who decide elections. They are undecided because they haven't been paying attention and have no training or capacity for critical thought. This message,"Obama is going to tax decent folks and give it to lazy coloreds", will resonate with them. Because these Archie Bunkers are the same people who gave us Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, and Chimpy.
by Anthony Segredo on Thu Oct 16, 2008 at 04:53:33 PM PDT
Certainly one "Joe the Plumber" is about to get his fifteen minutes of fame, whether that focuses attention on the real issue or not will determine if the millions of Joe (or Josephine) the Plumbers (and carpenters and mechanics and IT guys...) across America won or lost this last debate.I was off by thirteen minutes - but there are more of us than in Andy Warhol's day, and less time to spare. So perhaps in the future every American, like Joe, will be the subject of a two-minute hate.
1984 is about to become a reality, thanks to Mr. Obama and the extreme left Democratic Party. They'll persecute Christians. They'll disarm the American public. They'll do away with free speech via the "Fairness Doctrine." Association with Mr. Ayers and Rev. Wright do matter. A man's charachter is demonstrated by his behavior which also shows his true values. Mr. Obama values racism, hatred of America, corruption if it will buy power. This is what I see from his associations of the past. He is inexperienced and has shown he is unfit to command based upon his lack of understanding of the war on terrorism, the surge in Iraq and his hints at appeasement of true enemies. Joe the plumber matters not and if anyone takes him seriously then shame on them (including you, Mr. McCain). I don't like socialism or communism and Mr. Obama represents one and the mantle of total control of the House, the Senate, the White House and probably the Supreme Court by an extreme left-wing Democratic Party (as it is) can quickly lead to the other. Just for the record, I'm not wealthy, I am a veteran and I believe in God (not the miriad of "gods" as the politically correct mean when they speak of a "higher authority"). There, that should give rise to some four-letter expletives from our well-spoken Obamanation fans).Posted by Mike Booyce at October 19, 2008 08:25 PM Hide Comments | Show/Add Comments in Popup Window(1) | (Note: You must refresh main page to view newly posted comments here)