lol!

I was wondering why moving 11 Ospreys was news, but got the joke without following the 2d link.

Ft. Monroe, more recently known as the place where, during a Ft. Eustis Army Sport Parachute Club jump, Bob Larys, in the port "hellhole" of the UH-1D mistook the motions of Bob Surrells as time to exit, while still over Hampton Roads (the water to the right in the picture), with a howling wind blowing out to sea (from the left in the picture).

Man, did he have a puzzled look on his face as the rest of us on the port side craned our necks to watch him fall away.

I guess it was a lot funnier if you were there....

Yes, he made it back ok, without getting wet, but not by much. The rest of us exited over downtown Hampton....

Ft Monroe is also a great place to watch ships coming to and from Norfolk Naval Base and/or NNS&DDC.

”We can go against threats that F-16 (Fighting Falcons) and F-15s wouldn’t even think about trying to attack,” said Lt. Col. James Hecker, 27th Fighter Squadron commander.

Ummmm, what threats would that be? Most fighter guys I know think with enough planning, the right loadout and fuel they can take on about anything....and can.

“In boxing, if you fought a man you couldn’t see, he’d hit you all day,” the colonel said. That is what the Raptor does.

Ehhhhh, I see the Raptor just fine. The USAF and USN has been caught in this net before (i.e. the F-4 doesn't need a gun, it will kill the target before they even see it.......).... if in the "fog" you find yourself in close, stealth and super-cruise is only good for running away.

Hyperbole is OK for a FITREP is fine, but when discussing a warplane, it is just foolishness and arrogance.

That being said, F-22 (don't even think of calling it FA) is a great fighter that we need to stay one generation ahead of the enemy, but boy is it $$$$$$$. Buy what we need, not what we want; and roll the remaining funds into planes that can put more ord on target.....IMAO.

Ft. Monroe is also on the 2005 list of bases to be closed. At least some of the stories about the closure talk about turning the area into high-end housing.

That would be a sad end for a storied post.

Does it make me shallow that my main thought was "That sure is one pretty plane"??

The radical claims of the magical silver bullet that overwhelm the enemy with high kill rate have always been a myth in the modern era. A myth derived from computer simulation and canned scripted testing and manufacturing wanting to sell their new airplane. In real world testing like the Aimval-Aceval exercise that Col Riccioni refers to in his March 8, 2005 paper show what happened when F-5 flew against F-15’s. In this exercise when 4v4 sorties where flown the F-15 kill/loss ratio dropped all the way to 2-1.
During my own career I’ve seen the same thing when we would deploy to Nellis. I used to be amazed when the Aggressors would hand our Eagle Drivers their heads out on the range. Now that I’ve learned a few things on tactics and aircraft performance capability I understand how this happed.

Why does the F-22 have to become viable? The only possible justification of procurement is if we fight the Chinese. Now that said let’s look at the numbers, 180 aircraft built, 40 in a training role, 50 in Europe, 50 in the Pacific leaving 40 in the states. OK a squadron of 25 A/C, 1 in phase, 1 in load barn, 1 in K-ball, 22 left and lets be generous 90% of these FMC That leaves 19 to generate sorties with or in the case of the 50 in PACAF 38 jets maybe 40. The Chinese field approximately 120 SU-30’s with 40 on order for 06, first deliveries of 250 J-11 (SU-27 clone) are on going, first deliveries of 500 J-10 all due by 2010 has started. In addition there are over 1000 J-7 and J-8 aircraft flying and while termed obsolete by today’s standards they have been going through various upgrades in both avionics and weapons.

What other opponents are out there? Who else can afford these new generation jets (Raptor, Typhoon, Flanker) and operate them effectively? So what real advantage does this high cost plan bring to the battle? Some proponents will say stealth. Ok then some questions need answers. In radar signature how do we simultaneously defeat high frequency fighter radars and low frequency ground based systems? To launch missiles do we not have to turn on the radar at some point thereby eliminating electronic emissions stealth? And of course thermal emissions, with two enormous PW119 out the back which are then vulnerable to detection by many of the IR sensors that are available.

So by pressing on with the full F-22 buy we end up spending the full 70 BILLION dollars for 180 A/C that realistically have no one to fight except for the Chinese. This of course does not count other costs that no one talks about. For instance 1 billion a year for operations and maintenance, the cost of establishing a depot system, the cost of cleaning up any parts obsolescence in the avionics system plus whatever money is poured down the development drain to utilize the F-22 as a tactical bomber.
The net result like I have said before is a down sized force that cannot project power like today and a plane that has no relevance in 4th generation anti terrorist warfare.

LOLOL.. well since I live near WPAFB... I'll have to *ahem* keep an eye out for that *ahem* air traffic....

LOL