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Greetings! You are reading an article from The Mudville Gazette. To reach the front page, with all the latest news and views, click the logo above or "main" below. Thanks for stopping by!
« Take Back the Memorial | Main | Open Post »

July 25, 2005

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Religious Warfare

By Greyhawk

Chrenkoff:

Three Indonesian housewives face up to five years in prison for allegedly trying to lure Muslim children into Christianity at a Sunday School "Happy Week"...

The three women faced threats from a yelling mob of 150 fundamentalists during a court appearance in West Java last week. It is claimed that the women were teaching lessons in reading and writing to mixed classes of Christian and Muslim children, taking them on trips to parks and swimming pools, and rewarding them with treats such as pencils for memorising Christian prayers and Bible verses. Many of the alleged offences took place at a special Happy Week earlier this year, although the lessons began in 2003.

<...>

About 10,000 Christians were killed in Indonesia between 1998 and 2003 and about 1,000 churches were burnt down by Muslim mobs, according to campaigners. Although religious conflict has eased in recent years campaigners say that about 100 churches have been closed down in the past five years in West Java.

Don't worry about that sort of thing ever happening in America, where freedom from religion is a constitutional right. Here's the latest progress on stopping the fundies:

The Washington Post

The Anti-Defamation League has asked the U.S. Naval Academy to stop holding prayers before midshipmen eat lunch, saying the practice is an unconstitutional endorsement of religion.

The request was made in a June 17 letter from Abraham H. Foxman, the league's national director, to the academy's superintendent, Vice Adm. Rodney P. Rempt.

In the letter, Foxman says the constitutional separation of church and state is violated "when 4,000 midshipmen of many different faiths are brought together for compulsory prayer."

As precedent, the letter cites a recent ruling by a federal appeals court that organized mealtime prayers at the Virginia Military Institute were unconstitutional.

Chicago
A federal judge in Chicago says the Pentagon can't fund the National Boy Scout Jamboree after this year.

U-S District Court Judge Blanche Manning recently signed an injunction that bars the Defense Department from financially supporting future jamborees, which draw thousands of Boy Scouts from across the nation every four years.

More:
The June 22 order by U.S. District Judge Blanche Manning stems from a 1999 lawsuit by the American Civil Liberties Union of Illinois that claimed the Defense Department's sponsorship of the Scouts violates the First Amendment because the group requires its members to swear an oath of duty to God.

The Department of Justice, which represents the Defense Department in legal matters, said Thursday the government was still considering its options and had not yet decided whether to appeal, said Justice Department spokesman Charles Miller.

The order doesn't cover this year's National Scout Jamboree, which gets under way July 25 and is expected to draw more than 40,000 people to the Army's Fort A.P. Hill in Virginia. The next jamboree, typically held every four years, won't be held until 2010 to coincide with the Scout's 100th anniversary.

More:
Mr. Bork said the ACLU's actions show the watchdog group's lack of a "moral compass."

"This highlights more than anything else how rabid the ACLU is about the Scouts. They can't seem to let go of the Boy Scouts for anything. It's really unfortunate. They want to attack the Boy Scouts of America and the Pentagon for supporting the Boy Scouts, and they want to support kids running around naked in the woods."

Mr. Bork was referring to an ACLU lawsuit filed earlier this year in support of a proposed children's nudist camp in Virginia. A federal judge ruled in July that teens and children could not attend the camp without a parent or guardian.

"Their moral compass is turned around 180 degrees. I don't get it," Mr. Bork said.

Previous entries:

Banning Scouts from military installations:
Scout's Honor
Recognize these Medals?
The Latest

Banning Prayer from military academies:
Air Force Report Generates Widespread Confusion
Air Force Academy Update
From the Academy
God and Country
Chapel Doors Revisited
Locking the Chapel Doors
Are there Atheists in Cockpits?


Posted by Greyhawk / July 25, 2005 6:40 PM | Permalink

3 Comments

So, we've got a court case striking down compulsory prayer for government employees. Not forbidding prayer, mind, just saying it cannot be mandatory. And another case barring the use of tax dollars to support a private Christian organization. Sounds like the ACLU is doing good work to me (unlike their NAMBLA stuff).

Achillea
Boy Scouts aren't a Christian group.
http://www.mudvillegazette.com/archives/001816.html
read, and stop being a patsy for the ACLU.

Navy prayers alternate between Christian, Muslim, Jewish, etc. It helps build tolerance across all religious faiths. The Academy has already told the defamation league to stuff it.

"Their moral compass is turned around 180 degrees. I don't get it," Mr. Bork said.

While I sympathize with the Navy on this one, I must say that Mr. Bork is the last one you want to look at for guidence on religious freedom, unless you are a complete moonbat.

In his book "Slouching toward Gommorrah" he says that the First Ammendment only applies to political speech.

He rejects the idea that the law should interfere with an individual's liberty only to protect another person. He says: "society may properly set limits on what may be shown, said and sung." Even if it's religious in nature.

In the chapter "The Case for Censorship" he puts forth the idea that there is no distinction at all btween public vs private, and that the government has the right to choose what you read and see at any time.

To clarify, he wants books he doesn't like not only off the shelf of the bookstore and library, he wants them out of your house as well, and feels he has the right to send in the police to see that it is. In fact he argues that the more private something is the more salacious it is. Don't like art displays funded by the NEA? Bork says not simply that taxpayers should not pay for it, but that if the Goverenment doesn't like it, then it has every right not to allow it to be shown anywhere at all. Even in your own bedroom. No matter whether it's nudie pictures or just text critisizing the government printed on a wall.

You should be greatful you have the right to sit here and critisize the ACLU. In Borks version of reality the Government would decide who and what you are entitled to critisize for you and if you didn't like it, too bad. The man is a nutcase.

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November 26, 2010


America@war
[Greyhawk]
I think anyone who's ever pondered the "comment" option - once only available on blogs and bulletin boards, now ubiquitous on almost any web site - will appreciate this:
The so-called faculty of writing is not so much a faculty of writing as it is a faculty of thinking. When a man says, "I have an idea but I can't express it"; that man hasn't an idea but merely a vague feeling. If a man has a feeling of that kind, and will sit down for a half an hour and persistently try to put into writing what he feels, the probabilities are at least 90 percent that he will either be able to record it, or else realize that he has no idea at all. In either case, he will do himself a benefit.

That's wisdom from the past, captured for posterity at the US Naval Institute, shared via the web on the institute's 137th anniversary.

From their about page:

The Naval Institute shall remain

INDEPENDENT - A non-profit member association, with no government support, that does not lobby for special interests;

NON-PARTISAN - An independent, professional military association with a mission, goals and objectives that transcend political affiliations; and shall encourage

IDEAS - Through its respected journals Proceedings and Naval History, its conferences, its books and its online content, in support of those who serve.

"The Naval Institute has three core activities," among them, History and Preservation:

The Naval Institute also has recently introduced Americans at War, a living history of Americans at war in their own words and from their own experiences. These 90-second vignettes convey powerful stories of inspiration, pride, and patriotism.

Take a look at the collection, and you'll see it's not limited to accounts from those who served on ships at sea, members of the other branches are well-represented.

I'm fortunate to have met USNI's Mary Ripley, she's responsible for the institute's oral history program (and she's the daughter of the late John Ripley, whose story is told here). She also deserves much credit for their blog. ("We're not the Navy nor any government agency. Blog and comment freely.") We met at a milblog conference - Mary knew (and I would come to realize) that milbloggers are the 21st-century version of exactly what the US Naval Institute is all about. Once that light bulb came on in my head, I mentioned a vague idea for a project to her - milblogs as the 21st century oral history that they are.

"Put that in writing," she said (of course - see first paragraph above!) - and here's part of the result.

Shortly after the first tent was pitched by the American military in Iraq a wire was connected to a computer therein, and the internet was available to a generation of Americans at war - many of whom had grown up online. From that point on, at any given moment, somewhere in Iraq a Soldier, Sailor, Airman or Marine was at a keyboard sharing the events of his or her day with the folks back home. While most would simply fire off an email, others took advantage of the (then) relatively new online blogging platforms to post their thoughts and experiences for the entire world to see. The milblog was born - and from that moment to this stories detailing everything from the most mundane aspects of camp life to intense combat action (often described within hours of the event) have been available on the web...

And et cetera - but since you're reading this on a milblog, you probably knew that. And you know that milblogs aren't just blogs written by troops at war, that many friends, family members, and supporters likewise documented their story of America at war online in near-real time, as those stories developed.

The diversity in membership of that group is broad, the one thing we all have in common is the impulse to make sense of the seemingly senseless, and communicate the tale - for each of us that impulse was strong enough to overcome whatever barriers prevent the vast majority of people from doing the same. Everyone at some point has some vague idea they believe should be shared - we were the people who, from some combination of internal and external urging, found and spent those many half hours persistently trying to write it down.

*****

But where will all that be in another 137 years? Or five or ten, for that matter. That's something I've asked myself since at least 2004 - when I wrote this:

Closing Blogs is nothing new. So many site's owners just give up on their own. They come and go, you know, these MilBloggers do. Like any other sort of blogger. Many post in the lonely down hours far from home, spill their guts for the world, then abandon their spots when the tour of duty is up. They have lives again somewhere in the world, and no need to share the details. So it goes.

Many are truly gone - no site left at all. "The page cannot be found." Other blogs remain, like abandoned defensive positions in shifting desert sands.

Membership in the ghost battalion has grown in the years since, and an ever growing majority of those abandoned-but-still-standing sites are vanishing. Have you checked out Lt Smash's site lately? How about Sgt Hook's? If you're a long-time milblog reader you know the first widely-read milblog from Operation Iraq Freedom and the first widely-read milblog from Afghanistan are both gone from the web. If you're a relative newcomer to this world you may never even have heard of them - or the dozens upon dozens of others who carried forth the standard they set down.

If you have a vague notion that something should be done about that, (a notion I've heard expressed more than once...) then you and I and the good folks at the US Naval Institute are in agreement. Preserving the history documented by the milbloggers is just one of the goals of the milblog project, the once-vague idea that we're now making real.

And it's a big idea, if I say so myself - too big to explain in one simple blog post, so stand by for more. Likewise, it's too big a task to be accomplished by just one person. So if you're a milblogger (and exactly what is a milblogger? is a topic for much further discussion on its own) I'm asking for your help. All I'll really need is just a little bit (maybe just one or two of those half hours...) of your time, and your willingness to tell the tale.

We've already made history, it's time to save it.

(More to follow...)




Posted 4:02 PM | Permalink | Comments (0) |

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The Mudville Gazette is the on-line voice of an American warrior and his wife who stands by him. They prefer to see peaceful change render force of arms unnecessary. Until that day they stand fast with those who struggle for freedom, strike for reason, and pray for a better tomorrow.
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  • Patrick (Gryph): "Their moral compass is turned around 180 degrees. I don't read more
  • Old Soldier: Achillea Boy Scouts aren't a Christian group. http://www.mudvillegazette.com/archives/001816.html read, and read more
  • Achillea: So, we've got a court case striking down compulsory prayer read more

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The Mudville Gazette is written and produced by Greyhawk, who recently retired from 24 years of active duty in the US military, but will maintain this disclaimer: Unless otherwise credited, the opinions expressed are those of the author, and nothing here is to be taken as representing the official position of or endorsement by the United States Department of Defense or any of its subordinate components.

Furthermore, I will occasionally use satire or parody herein. The bottom line: it's my house.

I like having visitors to my house. I hope you are entertained. I fight for your right to free speech, and am thrilled when you exercise said rights here. Comments and e-mails are welcome, but all such communication is to be assumed to be 1)the original work of any who initiate said communication and 2)the property of the Mudville Gazette, with free use granted thereto for publication in electronic or written form. If you do NOT wish to have your message posted, write "CONFIDENTIAL" in the subject line of your email.

Original content copyright © 2003 - 2011 by Greyhawk. Fair, not-for-profit use of said material by others is encouraged, as long as acknowledgement and credit is given, to include the url of the original source post. Other arrangements can be made as needed.

Contact: greyhawk at mudvillegazette dot com

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*****

Tending Distant
Fires


Far from hearth and home, watching
Cold alone but not alone
On distant shore and only wanting
Safe return and little more

What tales we'll tell
When that time comes
When tales can be told

When things grim
Seem far away
When other fires go cold

Some distant sunset, vision fading
Memories remain
And tired eyes gaze 'pon folded flags
While distant drums beat their refrain

Saluting fallen friends whose names
And youth will never fade
Here's to those on other shores,
for them live well, the price is paid

- Greyhawk,
Baghdad,
December 2004