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 Greetings! You are reading an article from The Mudville Gazette. To reach the front page, with all the latest news and views, click the logo above or "main" below. Thanks for stopping by! May 10, 2005 Chapel Doors RevistedBy GreyhawkAn Associated Press piece in the Los Angeles Times updates us on the attack on the Air Force Academy by American United for Separation of Church and State Air Force General In Probe Is Nominated For A 2nd Star The "reporter" doesn't explain the use of "scare quotes", but does offer some details of the heinous crimes of the accused: Brig. Gen. Johnny Weida, the academy's No. 2 officer, was nominated to receive the second star of a major general.It's a wonder parents from all over the nation aren't yanking their young children out of the facility. "Rev" Barry Lynn, high priest of the AUSCS, is shocked and angered: "I am absolutely shocked that anyone would get a promotion in the middle of an investigation in which he is a central figure?. It casts doubt on the seriousness of this ongoing investigation," said the Rev. Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for the Separation of Church and State. His group conducted an investigation of religious intolerance at the academy and has threatened a lawsuit.Lynn's group was granted control of the military promotion system by the Imaginary Rights act of 1998. We here at Mudville urge no one to cast doubt on the seriousness of his investigation. See previous post "Closing the Chapel Doors" Posted by Greyhawk / May 10, 2005 11:19 PM | Permalink 4 TrackBacksThere is a lot out there - so much that I must serve up some hot links in order to get them out of my head, or I'll not be able to think clearly: First up: Mark R. Levin sent a blast from the past to NRO's The Corner and I link it here because it ne... Read More Question is...who is being more intolerant? Read More The New York Times reports A chaplain at the Air Force Academy has described a "systemic and pervasive" problem of religious proselytizing at the academy and says a religious tolerance program she helped create to deal with the problem was... Read More Jonathan Chait writes in favor of the anti-Christian witch hunt at the Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs (more on the issue can be found here, here, and here) in today's Los Angeles Times. We wanted to highlight one particularly egregious exam... Read More 17 Comments |
November 26, 2010America@war [Greyhawk]
I think anyone who's ever pondered the "comment" option - once only available on blogs and bulletin boards, now ubiquitous on almost any web site - will appreciate this:
The so-called faculty of writing is not so much a faculty of writing as it is a faculty of thinking. When a man says, "I have an idea but I can't express it"; that man hasn't an idea but merely a vague feeling. If a man has a feeling of that kind, and will sit down for a half an hour and persistently try to put into writing what he feels, the probabilities are at least 90 percent that he will either be able to record it, or else realize that he has no idea at all. In either case, he will do himself a benefit. That's wisdom from the past, captured for posterity at the US Naval Institute, shared via the web on the institute's 137th anniversary. From their about page:
"The Naval Institute has three core activities," among them, History and Preservation: The Naval Institute also has recently introduced Americans at War, a living history of Americans at war in their own words and from their own experiences. These 90-second vignettes convey powerful stories of inspiration, pride, and patriotism. Take a look at the collection, and you'll see it's not limited to accounts from those who served on ships at sea, members of the other branches are well-represented. I'm fortunate to have met USNI's Mary Ripley, she's responsible for the institute's oral history program (and she's the daughter of the late John Ripley, whose story is told here). She also deserves much credit for their blog. ("We're not the Navy nor any government agency. Blog and comment freely.") We met at a milblog conference - Mary knew (and I would come to realize) that milbloggers are the 21st-century version of exactly what the US Naval Institute is all about. Once that light bulb came on in my head, I mentioned a vague idea for a project to her - milblogs as the 21st century oral history that they are. "Put that in writing," she said (of course - see first paragraph above!) - and here's part of the result. Shortly after the first tent was pitched by the American military in Iraq a wire was connected to a computer therein, and the internet was available to a generation of Americans at war - many of whom had grown up online. From that point on, at any given moment, somewhere in Iraq a Soldier, Sailor, Airman or Marine was at a keyboard sharing the events of his or her day with the folks back home. While most would simply fire off an email, others took advantage of the (then) relatively new online blogging platforms to post their thoughts and experiences for the entire world to see. The milblog was born - and from that moment to this stories detailing everything from the most mundane aspects of camp life to intense combat action (often described within hours of the event) have been available on the web... And et cetera - but since you're reading this on a milblog, you probably knew that. And you know that milblogs aren't just blogs written by troops at war, that many friends, family members, and supporters likewise documented their story of America at war online in near-real time, as those stories developed. The diversity in membership of that group is broad, the one thing we all have in common is the impulse to make sense of the seemingly senseless, and communicate the tale - for each of us that impulse was strong enough to overcome whatever barriers prevent the vast majority of people from doing the same. Everyone at some point has some vague idea they believe should be shared - we were the people who, from some combination of internal and external urging, found and spent those many half hours persistently trying to write it down. But where will all that be in another 137 years? Or five or ten, for that matter. That's something I've asked myself since at least 2004 - when I wrote this:
Membership in the ghost battalion has grown in the years since, and an ever growing majority of those abandoned-but-still-standing sites are vanishing. Have you checked out Lt Smash's site lately? How about Sgt Hook's? If you're a long-time milblog reader you know the first widely-read milblog from Operation Iraq Freedom and the first widely-read milblog from Afghanistan are both gone from the web. If you're a relative newcomer to this world you may never even have heard of them - or the dozens upon dozens of others who carried forth the standard they set down. If you have a vague notion that something should be done about that, (a notion I've heard expressed more than once...) then you and I and the good folks at the US Naval Institute are in agreement. Preserving the history documented by the milbloggers is just one of the goals of the milblog project, the once-vague idea that we're now making real. And it's a big idea, if I say so myself - too big to explain in one simple blog post, so stand by for more. Likewise, it's too big a task to be accomplished by just one person. So if you're a milblogger (and exactly what is a milblogger? is a topic for much further discussion on its own) I'm asking for your help. All I'll really need is just a little bit (maybe just one or two of those half hours...) of your time, and your willingness to tell the tale. We've already made history, it's time to save it. (More to follow...) Posted 4:02 PM | Permalink |
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The Mudville Gazette is the on-line voice of an American warrior and his wife who stands by him. They prefer to see peaceful change render force of arms unnecessary. Until that day they stand fast with those who struggle for freedom, strike for reason, and pray for a better tomorrow.
 
 
 Furthermore, I will occasionally use satire or parody herein. The bottom line: it's my house. I like having visitors to my house. I hope you are entertained. I fight for your right to free speech, and am thrilled when you exercise said rights here. Comments and e-mails are welcome, but all such communication is to be assumed to be 1)the original work of any who initiate said communication and 2)the property of the Mudville Gazette, with free use granted thereto for publication in electronic or written form. If you do NOT wish to have your message posted, write "CONFIDENTIAL" in the subject line of your email. Original content copyright © 2003 - 2011 by Greyhawk. Fair, not-for-profit use of said material by others is encouraged, as long as acknowledgement and credit is given, to include the url of the original source post. Other arrangements can be made as needed. Contact: greyhawk at mudvillegazette dot com  Tending Distant Far from hearth and home, watching What tales we'll tell When things grim Some distant sunset, vision fading Saluting fallen friends whose names - Greyhawk, Baghdad, December 2004 |
Greyhawk:
Can anyone tell where Americans United gets most of its money and how much Barry Lynn gets paid? I am so sick of him popping up everywhere. And where did the Rev. Lynn get his divinity degree? I bet a good Philly cheesesteak he is a phony- any takers?
Well, my group has some pretty serious charges against the practices of religious groups [ we really hate, because, you know, they practice their fake religion and all and seem to believe it.] Uh, did I say that bracketed part out loud?
Next up - Klan gives key quote questioning racial preferences! Alert the media.
Doesn't it bother anyone else to hear a commanding officer tell his troops "cadets were accountable first to their God"?
I agree that a soldier should not obey an immoral order. And that is a judgement call where a soldier's faith is involved.
But at the same time our system is based on troops following orders. And as a nation of laws, that our laws set what is and is not a moral order.
If faith comes first, then each soldier is left to make their own decision. And what of those soldiers that choose to obey "thou shall not kill"?
What of the soldier that says he or she will not serve in Iraq because their faith says a pre-emptive invasion is wrong?
- dave
David:
The general has not forced cadets to attend church services, nor does it seem to me that he’s indicated a preference of any religion (e.g., Christianity vice Buddhism). The email he sent to cadets might have been well intentioned, and there is no un-truth to what he wrote.
People who profess a belief in God will normally place God’s law ahead of man’s law. In more than a quarter century of military service, I never received an illegal or immoral order, nor did I ever issue one. All military personnel have a duty to follow “lawful orders,” only.
With respect to “Thou Shalt Not Kill,” there is a modification: “Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s, Give unto God that which is God’s.” I personally see no conflict with the Mosaic Law in service to one’s country. However, when military personnel cannot in good conscious serve as a combatant they may apply for conscientious objector status. If status is granted, they may be assigned to non-combat roles, or separated from the service.
Do NOT underestimate Barry Lynn. He's an extremely intelligent and skillful advocate. He use to be on the old "Crossfire" radio show, the precursor to the CNN show, debating Pat Buchanan. He held his own and more. And whatever you think of Buchanan, he's a tough debater.
Granted, Lynn's a loon. But looniness combined with intelligence equals a tough foe.
SMG
The Navigators is a religious group centered at C. Springs which when I was around the Academy used pretty strange tactics on Catholic cadets and their girlfriends. Attacking them on their beliefs on the Pope and Virgin Mary. Ten "reborn" cadets arguing against one Catholic at a "bible study" until they "wanted" to be reborn. Also a heirarchy of Bible study groups where dating was only allowed within the heirarchies. No dating the freshman by senior bible study members was allowed.
If Academy grads and cadets are daring to speak up maybe you should honor and respect what they have gone through in order to do so.
I was around the Academy for 13 years, my dad was a tow pilot and sponsored a lot of cadets-one of which is now in line to be an astronaut and this story unfortunately through FIRSTHAND experience rings very true to me.
I don’t know how anybody can take Barry Lynn seriously as a “reverend” or as a balanced, disinterested expert in how religion should be accommodated in the public life of the United States.
Lynn is clearly on a mission to eliminate any vestiges of religion from public life. Lynn has been involved in lawsuits to end pre-meal prayers at VMI (Mellen v. Bunting, 341 F.3d 312 (2003)). He publicly advocates against prison ministry, working to keep our prisoners as morality free as possible (The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer, September 1, 2003). He is against the pledge of allegiance, alleging it is proselytization to bring people to Christianity (CNN Crossfire, July 5, 2002). He has advocated for the elimination of firefighter’s chaplains (Los Angeles Times June 17, 2003) – remember what Father Mychal Judge meant to the men dying on 9/11? And he is on record as being against chaplains in the military, something I’m sure every dying servicemember, who has fought to defend the First Amendment, would appreciate. (Hardball, CNBC News Transcripts, July 21, 1999). This doesn’t even scratch the surface.
David Thielen:
Take a moment to read Tolstoy's The Kingdom of God is Within You. Mr. Tolstoy slays your argument about troops and accountability quite nicely I think.
"With respect to “Thou Shalt Not Kill,” there is a modification: “Give unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s, Give unto God that which is God’s.” "
Actually, the original translation of that commandment is 'thou shalt not commit murder'. There is a big difference between killing and murdering.
"Lynn's group was granted control of the military promotion system by the Imaginary Rights act of 1998."
*snicker*
"An" (comment #6) says the Navigators prevented senior cadet Bible study members from dating freshman Bible study members. This is not the Navigators policy. This is USAFA policy and has been as long as I can remember. (I grew up there, have a father, brother and husband who are grads.) No upperclassman may date a four degree until after graduation when those four degrees become third classmen before the new class comes in.
As for the rest of this argument: is the climate at USAFA more opressively "Christian" than it used to be or are there just more people who want to complain about it?
Hey Gang
Buzz checking in again. I'm so incensed about "Reverend" Lynn I'm force to comment while on my anniversary vacation with my wife. As the beach and Mojitos call, I'm raging back in the room.
1st point, if the USAF, Congress and the POTUS think BG Weida is deserving of a second star, that tells me they think Lynn is in unfounded whack job. The GO screening process is much too tight to think they haven't thought this through.
Secondly, freshmen cadets are not allowed to date ANYONE. They're not even recognized as cadets until "Recognition" occurs in the spring.
Finally, the Navigators is a worldwide, international Christian organization that does happen to be located in C Springs. Having been in a Bible Study myself with their former president (a retired USAF 2-star ironically enough) they condone no such behavior.
Again, my experience as a commander at USAFA tells me this is all BS. There is absolutely no institutional pressure to believe, practice, or promote any religious views. NONE! As I said in an earlier post, I had to provide my Wicca cadets the same rights and access to worship as I did my Jewish cadets, my Islamic cadets and, yes, my Christian cadets.
ummmm... If that was really Buzz Patterson who
posted that last comment, there's no one who
knows better than he, or who is prepared to
"tell it like it is" than he.
AJ: If you really want to know where Lynn's group gets it money, you can call them and ask for a copy of their most recent IRS 990 form. I'd bet they receive a lot of donations, and may also recover money in lawsuits they file. Many nonprofits are funded as such. As for being a "phony," I don't know how one might judge that. A person's religious beliefs aer private and essentially unprovable. The Phillistines in DC who wear their religion on their sleeve and make a point to be photographed as often as they can with their heads bowed are the phonies, IMHO.
As to the notion about whether or not a soldier is first accountable to his/her god, I would think that a truly religious person would think that. Someone in charge of a government institution probably shouldn't make such a statement, unless if be viewed as an endorsement of a religion, but my guess is that most truly religious people put "god's laws" ahead of "man's laws." Of course, those same people must realize that while they are living here on Earth, they must follow man's laws, even when they conflict with god's laws, or else accept man's punishment.
Jaes, your query about whether the AFA is more oppressive or if there are just more people complaining is a good one. My guess would be that it is the latter, and that such complaints are a good thing. The military of today which is regularly missing its recruiting goals needs to be put on alert now that they cannot be a Christians-only club. We're getting to the point where beggars can't be choosers, and if atheists, wiccans, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists, and others see the military as hostile environments, they will be less likely to join. At least, that's my opinion.
Gregy
It's me. Still trying to keep my finger on the pulse of USAFA and definitely still trying to out Left attacks on our military. Attempts like these are counter-productive to what we do and anger the hell out of me.
Buzz
I think this is "accountable to god" qoute is being taken out of context and being misinterpreted. I was told by a wise chaplain once that you must have some type of spiritual belief system to fall back on at the end of the day. To stay mentally healthy you must have some way of atoning or finding mental peace. Alot of folks find this in religion or in a God of some type. But it doesn't have to be this way. It could simply be meditation or exercising. I believe that this is what Gen. Weida meant. It does not mean that you can disobey orders. It just means that when the stuff hits the fan and you are stressed and think you can't take anymore, you have to have a way of relaxing and finding some answers for yourself.. Just my two cents.
I'm a USAFA '95 grad. Lynn is a misdirected but dangerous soul who needs help and compassion. He's obviously very angry about something from his past. Militaries of more nations than just ours have traditionally recruited clergy of many faiths to minister to the spiritual needs of the troops. (Even fire departments, police departments, and prisons have chaplains, who often work voluntarily) DoD and congress see fit to fund and staff a chaplain corps that represents all major religions. All major bases have chaplains, and yes, chaplains are deployed into nasty combat zones as well. Point being, even congress realizes the importance of meeting spiritual needs of men and women in uniform. Now Lynn, in all his man-given wisdom, says that all history, tradition, and precedent are wrong. In my 4 years at USAFA, I was invited to many Christian activities, but I was never pressured or shunned as a result of not going. No one I know was shunned either. I do remember one guy who was a "proselytizing atheist" so I'm sure you could dig up a few people who could complain about Christians, but my guess is they'd complain regardless of the school they attended or how nominal the beliefs of the offending Christians.