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Greetings! You are reading an article from The Mudville Gazette. To reach the front page, with all the latest news and views, click the logo above or "main" below. Thanks for stopping by! February 27, 2004 The Bright and Shining MomentBy GreyhawkI would grow tired of examining John Kerry's military career, but since George W. Bush's military experience has been explored thoroughly here it's only fitting that his opponent gets equal time. Without further ado, from Snopes.com, the defining moment of John Kerry's Vietnam experience: Kerry earned his Silver Star on 28 February 1969, when he beached his craft and jumped off it with an M-16 rifle in hand to chase and shoot a guerrilla who was running into position to launch a B-40 rocket at Kerry's boat. Contrary to the account quoted above, Kerry did not shoot a "Charlie" who had "fired at the boat and missed," whose "rocket launcher was empty," and who was "already dead or dying" after being "knocked down with a .50 caliber round." Kerry's boat had been hit by a rocket fired by someone else — the guerrilla in question was still armed with a live B-40 and had only been clipped in the leg; when the guerrilla got up to run, Kerry assumed he was getting into position to launch a rocket and shot him: Comments are open. Exercise your right to freedom of speech while you can. Posted by Greyhawk / February 27, 2004 1:23 PM | Permalink 10 Comments |
November 26, 2010America@war [Greyhawk]
I think anyone who's ever pondered the "comment" option - once only available on blogs and bulletin boards, now ubiquitous on almost any web site - will appreciate this:
The so-called faculty of writing is not so much a faculty of writing as it is a faculty of thinking. When a man says, "I have an idea but I can't express it"; that man hasn't an idea but merely a vague feeling. If a man has a feeling of that kind, and will sit down for a half an hour and persistently try to put into writing what he feels, the probabilities are at least 90 percent that he will either be able to record it, or else realize that he has no idea at all. In either case, he will do himself a benefit. That's wisdom from the past, captured for posterity at the US Naval Institute, shared via the web on the institute's 137th anniversary. From their about page:
"The Naval Institute has three core activities," among them, History and Preservation: The Naval Institute also has recently introduced Americans at War, a living history of Americans at war in their own words and from their own experiences. These 90-second vignettes convey powerful stories of inspiration, pride, and patriotism. Take a look at the collection, and you'll see it's not limited to accounts from those who served on ships at sea, members of the other branches are well-represented. I'm fortunate to have met USNI's Mary Ripley, she's responsible for the institute's oral history program (and she's the daughter of the late John Ripley, whose story is told here). She also deserves much credit for their blog. ("We're not the Navy nor any government agency. Blog and comment freely.") We met at a milblog conference - Mary knew (and I would come to realize) that milbloggers are the 21st-century version of exactly what the US Naval Institute is all about. Once that light bulb came on in my head, I mentioned a vague idea for a project to her - milblogs as the 21st century oral history that they are. "Put that in writing," she said (of course - see first paragraph above!) - and here's part of the result. Shortly after the first tent was pitched by the American military in Iraq a wire was connected to a computer therein, and the internet was available to a generation of Americans at war - many of whom had grown up online. From that point on, at any given moment, somewhere in Iraq a Soldier, Sailor, Airman or Marine was at a keyboard sharing the events of his or her day with the folks back home. While most would simply fire off an email, others took advantage of the (then) relatively new online blogging platforms to post their thoughts and experiences for the entire world to see. The milblog was born - and from that moment to this stories detailing everything from the most mundane aspects of camp life to intense combat action (often described within hours of the event) have been available on the web... And et cetera - but since you're reading this on a milblog, you probably knew that. And you know that milblogs aren't just blogs written by troops at war, that many friends, family members, and supporters likewise documented their story of America at war online in near-real time, as those stories developed. The diversity in membership of that group is broad, the one thing we all have in common is the impulse to make sense of the seemingly senseless, and communicate the tale - for each of us that impulse was strong enough to overcome whatever barriers prevent the vast majority of people from doing the same. Everyone at some point has some vague idea they believe should be shared - we were the people who, from some combination of internal and external urging, found and spent those many half hours persistently trying to write it down. But where will all that be in another 137 years? Or five or ten, for that matter. That's something I've asked myself since at least 2004 - when I wrote this:
Membership in the ghost battalion has grown in the years since, and an ever growing majority of those abandoned-but-still-standing sites are vanishing. Have you checked out Lt Smash's site lately? How about Sgt Hook's? If you're a long-time milblog reader you know the first widely-read milblog from Operation Iraq Freedom and the first widely-read milblog from Afghanistan are both gone from the web. If you're a relative newcomer to this world you may never even have heard of them - or the dozens upon dozens of others who carried forth the standard they set down. If you have a vague notion that something should be done about that, (a notion I've heard expressed more than once...) then you and I and the good folks at the US Naval Institute are in agreement. Preserving the history documented by the milbloggers is just one of the goals of the milblog project, the once-vague idea that we're now making real. And it's a big idea, if I say so myself - too big to explain in one simple blog post, so stand by for more. Likewise, it's too big a task to be accomplished by just one person. So if you're a milblogger (and exactly what is a milblogger? is a topic for much further discussion on its own) I'm asking for your help. All I'll really need is just a little bit (maybe just one or two of those half hours...) of your time, and your willingness to tell the tale. We've already made history, it's time to save it. (More to follow...) Posted 4:02 PM | Permalink |
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The Mudville Gazette is the on-line voice of an American warrior and his wife who stands by him. They prefer to see peaceful change render force of arms unnecessary. Until that day they stand fast with those who struggle for freedom, strike for reason, and pray for a better tomorrow.
![]() Furthermore, I will occasionally use satire or parody herein. The bottom line: it's my house. I like having visitors to my house. I hope you are entertained. I fight for your right to free speech, and am thrilled when you exercise said rights here. Comments and e-mails are welcome, but all such communication is to be assumed to be 1)the original work of any who initiate said communication and 2)the property of the Mudville Gazette, with free use granted thereto for publication in electronic or written form. If you do NOT wish to have your message posted, write "CONFIDENTIAL" in the subject line of your email. Original content copyright © 2003 - 2011 by Greyhawk. Fair, not-for-profit use of said material by others is encouraged, as long as acknowledgement and credit is given, to include the url of the original source post. Other arrangements can be made as needed. Contact: greyhawk at mudvillegazette dot com ![]() Tending Distant Far from hearth and home, watching What tales we'll tell When things grim Some distant sunset, vision fading Saluting fallen friends whose names - Greyhawk, Baghdad, December 2004 |
"Numerically Superior Force"?!
1 Guerilla?
A 26 man SF Team in Iraq, held off a entire *brigade* for 5 days.....
(RE: 'We called the spot "The Alamo' http://www.vfw.org/index.cfm?fa=news.magDtl&dtl=3&mid=1581 )
I see no comparison.
This is garbage and deserves no credence. Snopes cites ONLY 3 pro-Kerry sources, 2 of which are the Boston Globe (owned also by those who own the New York Times) and Brinkley's recent promotional 'puff' or pre-campaign advertising book. I used to respect snopes and enjoy it, but this is a piss-poor excuse for whitewashing. Completely unsat.
NOWHERE ELSE can substantiation be found for the details of the following paragraph:
"Kerry earned his Silver Star on 28 February 1969, when he beached his craft and jumped off it with an M-16 rifle in hand to chase and shoot a guerrilla who was running into position to launch a B-40 rocket at Kerry's boat. Contrary to the account quoted above, Kerry did not shoot a "Charlie" who had "fired at the boat and missed," whose "rocket launcher was empty," and who was "already dead or dying" after being "knocked down with a .50 caliber round." Kerry's boat had been hit by a rocket fired by someone else — the guerrilla in question was still armed with a live B-40 and had only been clipped in the leg; when the guerrilla got up to run, Kerry assumed he was getting into position to launch a rocket and shot him: "
BloodSprite- my thoughts exactly.
For another comparison here is the URL for
the medal citations for the Marines of India Company, 3rd Battalion, 5th Marines, 1st Marine division during Operation HASTINGS.
http://www.combatwife.net/hastingscitations.htm
Beaching the boat like that was inexcusable. To elavate the bow to the point that the .50 couldn't bear on the VC means that he struck the bank at considerable speed, which could have torn the hull open if he had hit an obstruction. Once beached, they were a sitting duck. The only real defense those boats had against fire was speed. Most River Rats will tell you behavior like that should have gotten him in the sling, not a medal.
It's interesting that Kerry's former CO, George Elliott, said he was speaking only "half" tongue in cheek when he acknowledged his conundrum over whether to recommend a court martial or a medal for him. I believe the Navy realized what a reckless and potentially disastrous liability they had on their hands with Lt (jg) Kerry. It's a real possibility that it was they who used the "three hearts and you're out" rule to get him out of there. Does anyone know of another officer anywhere, at any time, who was willing to abandon his command by making such a request?
I am not a military man, and I admire and respect those of you who serve. Thanks.
Can someone answer some stupid questions for me? Why beach the boat? Would this make any sense as an offensive move? Would the guns be more effective if the boat was stabilized by being beached, or was he going to "lead a landing party ashore" and attack on foot? Is that an effective use of the resources he had? Is that even a reasonable strategy, since those left in the boat would be sitting ducks, not able to leave? Maybe it makes sense, just asking.
I also couldn't help but notice the Silver Star write up does not match the story as told by Kerry and the witnesses. They said that there was a near miss with a rocket which broke a window on the boat. So Kerry beached the boat. Then a teenager with a rocket launcher emerges from the bush, apperently to the surprise of both parties. The kid is wounded in the leg and runs, perhaps trying to get enough distance to use the rocket. Now the boat is beached, and about to be hit by a rocket, so Kerry chases the kid and shoots him before the kid can kill Kerry and crew. Fair enough, probably didn't have a lot of other options right then. Simple self defense.
The Silver Star write up says with "disregard for ... the enemy rockets", he "beached his boat only 10 feet from the Viet Cong rocket position" and led "a landing party" ashore in pursuit of the enemy. It seemes he had no idea the kid with the rocket launcher was there, he did not chose that location to beach to attack the "Viet Cong rocket position" as the write up implies. He did not lead a "landing party in pursuit of the enemy", but chased a wounded kid so that his beached boat wouldn't get blown up. Not the premeditated, fearless action the write up implies.
I don't imagine these medal write-ups were done under penalty of perjury. This one certainly seems to be at the least streching things.
Rob C, you must not confuse the Democrats with facts, for their minds are made up: Kerry did good, killed women and children and friendly South Vietnamese soldiers by mistrake, and endangered his crew and boat in a serious breach of policy BUT he wasn't killed nor were any of his crew, SO Kerry is a hero. (puke!)
Rob C, don't ask so many questions. Democrats criticize you for 'playing dirty politics' if you seek to ascertain the truth for yourself, or remind us of the truth of the matter!
Since when did swift boat commanders "personally lead a landing party ashore in pursuit of the enemy"?
These crews were not trained to conduct clear and sweeps ashore, which makes me question why, in the movie of Kerry walking around in jungle, is he wearing jungle fatigues, helmet and m16 bandoleers.
It's also a well documented fact that officers in Vietnam were put in for awards for valor that were dubious at best, especially considering what the average grunt experienced on a frequent basis.
I know a great many Vietnam vets and current military personnel that are appalled at John Kerry touting his own stellar "Military Service Career". Purple hearts - not for life threatening injuries, but for small scrapes that most men would have too much pride to even leave the front lines for...a silver medal for an action such as this described here...sent home after three months of service in Vietnam because of his accumulation of purple hearts...and, by the way-he threw his ribbons - not his medals - he threw someone else's medals for them. Ribbons are much different than medals to military personnel. I am proud of the time that my father has put in, the service that my father has given this country, the sacrifice that our family and my father has made for this country. I don't believe that John Kerry made the same sacrifices and gave the same service in military terms, so he should not even bring it up.
So some of you are upset that a guy got some medals and a ticket out of the s**t. Good for him
I can't beleive that you question the war record of someone with medals against someone who didn't go. Does't make him better or worse for President than the other guy but does have a hell of a better military record. less you have been you dont know.